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-- [[LaunchpadHome:databubble]] <<DateTime(2008-10-18T07:11:00Z)>>


  • Add your feedback like this w/o the bold, and then use the @SIG@ at the end of your line, look at the first post for reference

  • All serious issues should be still submitted as bug!

  • Please nest a reply when you are responding on another reaction. Otherwise it will grow in a mess.... Thank you.

  • We do not usually respond to these comments, there are too many, but they do go directly into the developers e-mail and every one is read

This is great release. KDE4 is much better than KDE3. But I still have few suggestions for improvement of visual experience. In Intrepid Ibex a there are still some KDE3 applications (ooo dialogs, digikam etc.), they are functional, but look ugly near KDE4 oxygen style applications. It is possible to set for kde3 default icon style to oxygen icons for kde3 (available in ) after that kde3 applications are more similar to kde4.Gtk applications look almost like native kde4 applications if kde4 gtk style is used. I think oxygen icons for kde3 applications should be used by default to keep visual integrity of OS. Cheers, and thanks for wonderful release.

I have been testing this beta, and I see many display-related issues. Firefox, for example, looks quite ugly. The tabs don't show properly, and there are display issues when viewing my Gmail email as well. Furthermore, I see a problem with fonts. The different in size between font size 11 and size 12 is quite big. Going up from size 9 to 10 to 11 is okay. Then, size 12 suddenly becomes huge! The trouble is, size 12 is my preferred font size (I use that currently on Feisty, where it looks fine). I also notice that the fonts do not look the same on KDE apps and firefox, even though I have set the option in KDE's control panel to apply the same font to GTK apps. All this works just fine under Feisty, but looks broken on this beta. Sadly, Feisty is not going to be supported soon, otherwise I'd happily stick to it for at least another year.

I was not able to obtain an interface in my language (italian): I selected Italian in Ubiquity, but Kde is still in english (apart from konqueror and some parts of other apps). Even if I install kde-l10n-it (which isn't installed by default) the situation remains the same. In hardy I have a full kde 4.1 in italian. Also I didn't see a button for managing users in systemsettings, as in kde3: that would be useful. Apart from this it is a great release. Thanks!

I've been testing the beta for a whole day, and love what I've seen so far! Loved KDE3 in Kubuntu 8.04 and LOVE KDE4 in Kubuntu 8.10 beta! So far only a few minor bugs have showed, nothing at all serious. One "bug" that is still present from 8.04 is that, when using logitech dinovo edge bluetooth keyboard with usb dongle, I have to pull out, replug and reconnect ("pair") the dongle after every boot. I circumvent this by disabling bluetooth ("sudo update-rc.d -f bluetooth remove"). Also the ctrl+c for copy didn't work until I configured klipper to "ignore selection", but this may have been a coincidence. Thanks for a great release! -- oekj 2008-10-03 16:28:00

Now these are my impressions after a few days of fiddeling with the beta:

  • At first I had a problem with the scim client causing apps to take very long to start. fixed that by uninstalling the scim client. a bug about that has already been filed by others.
  • Another problem was koficce not starting. I found out that this wwas due to a conflict between previously installed koffice 2 alpha packages and the koffice 1 packages installed by intrepid beta. Fixed that by removing koffice 2.
  • Adept 3 is looking nice but behaves strangely: When typing a package name (correctly) after some letters typed the package appears in the list but disappears again after more kys typed. There is also a bug about that filed.
  • I don't know why the contents of the .kde4 directory for hardy kde4 remix users isn't automatically transferred to .kde. At first I wondered where all my setings, mails etc. where gone until I found they were still in .kde4. Copied some files over to .kde and now all works well again.

There seems to be a conflict between knetworkmanager and network-manager-gnome. I have kde4 and xfce installed and after upgrading to intrepid beta, suddenly both network-manager frontends showed up on both desktops. The only thing that helped was removing the gnome version. But since knetworkmanager works well under xfce, that wasn' really a problem. Now to the biggest improvements for me compared to kde 4.1.1 on hardy:

  • Guidance Power Manager does so much more than the standard battery widget: current frequency, brightness settings... can't imagine life without it Wink ;)

  • The quick access plasmoid is pretty neat!
  • And lastly, perhaps rather unimportant for many, but key for my tablet-pc: Xrandr rotation finally works on my computer! Finally I can read my documents comfortably in kde4! Krandr tray still doesn't rotate on my machine (toshiba m200), but my xrandr script now works (at least most of the time).

All in all, it seems to be getting better and better and I hope I can soon live without Xfce. -- o-monroe 2008-10-06 22:16:57

My initial impressions are 'very good'. While the KDE 4.0 version I tried was just not ready for me, this one gave me the feeling that it was time to migrate to KDE4, which I am in the process of doing. Thus far I have not hit any show-stoppers. It's obvious the devs have put a lot of excellent work into bringing KDE4 to this level of functionality. The OS has a slick feel. Below I'll mostly talk about things that didn't work, but I wish to emphasize that a great deal DOES work - or I would stay with KDE3.

Overall I get the impression that the devs need to test their work a little before releasing it. There are a lot of tiny bugs which could be resolved by the dev just playing with the program for an hour and making a list of problems, then addressing them. This kind of direct testing is important. Otherwise these little bugs clog the bug reporting system, hiding more important bugs, or worse don't get reported. It's hard to take the time to file a bug report on these little non-showstoppers. But they give the work a sloppy feel. I mean it literally when I say one hour of testing could save you many hours later. Back when I wrote software my users would comment how my betas were more bug-free than most final releases. It wasn't that I didn't make mistakes, it was simply that I tested things myself as much as possible. The other comment was that I had a very fast development process - and the direct testing by myself was part of that.

A few examples, not complete: In Adept, the search function works poorly. Typing "kd" might return nothing, then adding an "e" will display a list briefly, then it will vanish. It's obvious that whoever worked on this simply did not test it. Or, perhaps you need a person who's job it is to test the interoperability of the components programmed by various devs. You don't need beta testers to point out these obvious things - that's a very slow way of getting things polished. Rely on beta testers to show you the things you can't find yourself (due to other hardware they're using, etc).

In Dolphin, the column widths are not remembered. This means that if I change my font size, then when I reopen Dolphin it's a mess. This is probably on the to-do list as opposed to a bug. Same in Konqueror file manager - column widths are forgotten. Minor perhaps, but this alone stopped me from using either of them as my file manager. If it wasn't for Krusader, I would have scrapped KDE4 due to this alone. Also, Konqueror allows you to change to a custom Details font, but then forgets it. This is a good example of a bug which one hour of testing would reveal. Also, Dolphin has no way to remember the open tabs, meaning I have to reopen them every time I open Dolphin. Needs a 'save session'. Plus, kdesudo (in a servicemenu) crashes Dolphin (it will open the kdesudo app then close itself). And why no 'Edit as Root'? Let's not make things unusable in the interests of usability.

The Adept window does not remember its size. The new Adept has some great features. Took me awhile to figure out how the six icons controlling what is displayed work. I thought only one of each row of three was active - they are not rendered very clearly. It was perplexing to say the least - needed a popup to explain it. Useful but odd interface that newbies may not understand. You might want to have a 'Simple/Advanced' setting that changes the overall interface.

Speaking of which, it's good to make KDE accessible to the masses. However, it is becoming dumbed down as a result. It takes me hours just to make it usuable. Maybe when a new user is added (including by the installation program) it should inquire on the level of the user's expertise (New, Intermediate, Power User), and use an appropriate template. This way the new users aren't confused, and the experienced users don't feel forgotten. A master control on each GUI program which shows a simple vs advanced interface would be helpful in keeping everyone happy. It's important not to dumb down the OS in the interests of usability (Microsoft, anyone?) I think this would be a great functional innovation to incorporate into KDE4's GUI, as opposed to just shiney visual effects, etc.

The Hardware Drivers (jockey) app was not able to install my nvidia driver for some reason. It would prompt for my password then do nothing. Once I installed the appropriate packages in Adept then jockey was able to activate the driver.

I am not fond of the python printer applet and notifier. Why are these written in python? It is the only thing on my system that requires python and it consumes large amounts of memory for a small task. This is the beginning of going down the Windows road.

Overall, I find aspects of KDE4 sluggish, even on a very fast dual-core system. Perhaps this just means things haven't yet been optimized for speed. For example, just clicking on a folder in KonquerorFM causes quite a pause before it is opened.

The Menu Editor needs some of that pre-beta testing. Keyboard shortcuts for my apps did not work. To get them to work I had to first set them in Menu Editor, then go into System Settings|Keyboard| KB Shortcuts|KHotkeys and change them to 'Default', clicking on 'Reassign' when prompted. Quite a procedure. Something in there is messed up, and has been since 4.0. Lack of KB shortcuts was one reason I couldn't use 4.0. Fortunately I found a workaround. Why this glaring lack of functionality in something so basic?

I miss a quickstart in the tray for my commonly used apps, unless I am missing it. I see no way to add icons to the tray. Just widgets. Why no am/pm clock still? Are we all in the army now? The taskbar has potentional, but needs some attention.

I see no screensavers available except 'blank screen'. Bug or to-do?

One other thing, as it has always done for many versions of Kubuntu, the alternate installer offers to mount my ntfs partition but then says it cannot, so I have to go back and tell the partitioner to ignore it, then manually add it to fstab later. (The ntfs partition contains a fresh install of WinXP on a new drive this time, so I know it's not the partition.)

All of that said, Intrepid-beta is the first Ubuntu OS I have working functionally in 64 bit. Only thing I had to sacrifice so far is a fully functional java browser plugin (which seems unbelievable in 2008, but is not terribly important to me).

To summarize, given all the work done on KDE4, I think it would be worth it for the devs to do some high-level testing - just play with options and using it and watch what happens. It's very time consuming for me to report tiny bugs, just as it is time consuming for you to plow through them. The devil is in the details. The other important thing is for KDE4 to address the Simple/Advanced interface issue in a fundamental way, such that neither is sacrificed for the other. Finally, beware of bloat and sluggishness - don't tolerate it or it will take over the OS. I hope this feedback is useful to you and thanks for your work. -- ignorantguru 2008-10-10 15:53:44


I used to test new versions of Kubuntu on an old Sony Vaio PCG-XG19 I had set aside more or less solely for that purpose. I am finding that Intrepid beta is just too slow to meaningfully use on it. Probably you ought to list the specs for the system on the download page, (If they're not there already.)<br/>

A couple of other issues I noticed (and will file bugs on):

  • I installed the OS when I was offline, and when I came online there were three icons on the task bar telling me that the language pack wasn't properly installed. I would click on them, but nothing much seemed to happen.
  • When I used the system settings to set the language to US English, it wouldn't save. I would see the saving bar, it would get to 90 or 95% and then start over. It would go into a loop and start over and over, but never complete. When I clicked cancel and went back into system settings, I noticed that it was set to US English, so at least part of it was saved.
  • When I used Adept to load the package lists, I can't search for anything. Or at least, it almost never seems to show anything in the search results window on the right. Is it possible that this is just because my machine is so slow?
  • I couldn't therefore use Adept to install Firefox. When I did finally install it, (using apt-get) I notice that it didn't appear in the start menu, until I logged out

I hope to be able to try this on a bigger/faster machine, maybe it works there. -- mgolden 2009-01-10 13:44:44

I have used it now for about two days and I am really impressed with some of the work that was done. The spliting feature for Konsole and Okular are the most outstanding features for me. (Edit: The new grub settings GUI is also great). I expected more from the new konqueror. Is it based on webkit yet? It seems pretty slow. Some Issues:

  • NetworkManager doesn't work for me, I do not even know where I could configure it, such that it uses the wpa_supplicant settings I want it to. No man page Sad :-(

  • A lot of things changed, that wouldn't have to: Lots of keyboard shortcuts, Vanished Icons, the amarok collection information (only the file locations, my ratings were still there). Where are the Web Shortcuts in Konqueror (Edit: I found out they are still there. Yet the keyword separator was set back to colon. So the this still fits the point I made)? Typing wp something for a wikipedia search is so convenient.
  • Many things are unconfigurable (which I am not used to with KDE): Keyboard shortcut for Show Desktop? Font size of the login screen?

Anyway, I am looking forward for this beta release to mature. The basis is very cool!

After 13 years away from UNIX systems, I decided this week that I really needed to stand up a home Linux server and give the kubuntu 8.10 beta a try. I decided to purchase a new, mid-range system with dual core AMD 64-bit CPU, 4GB RAM, and a 1TB HD and was looking for a motherboard that would let me do dual VGA and HDMI.

(I know, I know…. Linux newbie, beta OS, and too new hardware….recipe for disaster, right? I’m not even a developer!)

The hardware I purchased was : Motherboard: Asus M3N78-VM (BIOS v0702) Chipset: Nvidia GeForce 8200 (VBIOS 62.77.2f.00.00) 512MB RAM Memory: 4GB (2 x OCZ 2G DDR2 PC2 6400) CPU: AMD Athlon X2 6000+ 64bit AM2 2MB Disk: Seagate 1TB SATA II 32MB CD: SAMSUNG 22X INTERNAL SATA DVDRW BK

Since this server is meant to do media streaming, and it’s location doesn’t easily let me use wired Ethernet, I purchased a D-Link DWA-552 (Atheros AR5008) 802.11n PCI card. I chose this card after much googling to determine that it is one of the most widely available and inexpensive 802.11n cards that has a native Linux driver (ath9k).

Bug 1 Cannot install using LiveCD - no graphics support for the GeForce 8200, and I needed to go to the alternate install CD. Alternate install worked fine, right up to booting the server.

Bug 2 I kept getting the following message when the kernel was loading:

CPU 0: aperture @ 0 size 32 MB No AGP bridge found Your BIOS doesn't leave a aperture memory hole Please enable the IOMMU option in the BIOS setup This costs you 64 MB of RAM "

I found the issue discussed in the following thread

Basically, my motherboard does not use AGP, there is no IOMMU option in BIOS setup. The work-around is to boot the kernel with “iommu=noaperture” kernel parameter

Bug 3 On booting the new system, X failed to start. I discovered I needed to install the driver package from Nvidia’s web site in order to get X running:

Bug 4 Auth9k 802.11n driver intermittently hangs system

By hangs, I mean that the screen goes all one colour (blue or black normally), and I can’t switch to a pseudo tty, and can’t toggle num/caps lock keys on keyboard. Requires reboot, and frequently a hard reset (power down, wait, power-up(

Initially, the system would hang very shortly after configuring the connection. (Good news is, that I was able to create the connection, associate with the AP, and do limited browsing / download, before the system would hang.)

I discovered that the hangs got a lot less when I installed the Nvidia accelerated graphics driver (version 177) using the Hardware Drivers wizard.

The system would not crash at all, as long as I didn’t try to configure the network.

I later discovered that the crashing became less frequent when I configured the router to support a wide (40MHz) wireless-N channel. With the router supporting a single, 20MHz, channel for wireless-N, or in B/G mode only, the server would crash quite frequently.

Configured with a wide wireless-N channel, I can now often work for an hour or two before the system freezes. I was even able to install the 325 updates that the system reported when I first connected to the internet.

More frequent when router is configured for single (20MHz) channel, or BG only, than n with 20MHz channel

For me this is the one bug that matters…. Kubuntu really needs to support at least one wireless-N PCI card (I’ll buy which ever one it is!) very well – without crashing and with very high throughput – for me to use the OS.

Bug 5 At one point, during all my crashes and reboots, I would be able to login graphically on the console, and would get X running, and have control of my cursor…. But kde would die after showing thee loading screen and I’d get the message “Could not start ksmserver”

After much fiddling, I was able to resolve this by removing .kdt in my user directory and logging in again.

Unfortunately, I’m a fool….should have tar’d up the directory so devs could have a look at what was causing it to not load.

Bug 6 Bluetooth tray widget disappeared from Task Manager

Before I installed the 325 updates, I had a Bluetooth icon in the Task Manager panel (using a USB Bluetooth adapter). I could configuring it, to make it discoverable, although I was unable to get my Bluetooth keyboard to show when scanning for it (yes, it was discoverable….my phone confirms it.)

Then after installing all the updates…. Now there’s no Bluetooth icon there anymore. I was able to verify that the driver is still there and responding….it picks up the Bluetooth MAC address from the dongle… but for the life of me I can’t figure out how to put my Bluetooth icon back. Choosing kdebluetooth4 from the app launcher does nothing.

Where did Bluetooth go? I’d really like to get it back and try to configure my Bluetooth keyboard/mouse.


I’ve spend two solid days working with 8.10. I’m impressed it was actually so easy to install… despite having to use the alternate CD, and despite having to install the video driver package. I’m impressed with the potential of the OS, the bundled software, and the power of Adept.

Clearly getting the beta running on very recent hardware is a challenge, and I’m glad of my prior experience. The lack of solid 802.11n support is very disappointing, and a show-stopper for my using the OS if it isn’t fixed.

Over-all, it’s amazing work…. Kudos to all who have worked on it… but I’d be very surprised if it’s stable enough to release Oct. 30.

-- databubble 2008-10-18 07:11:00

IntrepidIbex/Beta/Kubuntu/Feedback (last edited 2008-10-23 11:19:39 by a88-113-54-143)